An email to the VZW CEO

[dtdlurch]

Imagine a PC mfg selling locked down computers with unremovable bloat. That WOULD NOT fly.

+1. At this point there is little difference. These phones can do pretty much everything most computers can. And as sad as it is, my phone is actually better spec-wise than my grandparents computer. So if it wouldn't fly on a pc then why should we let it fly?

Sent from my Liberated D2G

The difference is licensing and carrier contracts. They agree to sell Moto phones and somewhere in the contract they come to an agreement of what will be on the phone. Then you make a contract with Verizon because you aren't just buying a mini-computer, but a service as well that Verizon has "authorized" that mini-computer to use. In that contract, you are agreeing to whatever lame terms on hardware lockdown they wish to uphold. They stamp the phone with their logo and then sell the phone to you at a "discount" more often than not. So technically, they got you by the man stones and can do whatever they want to that phone because you bought a Verizon phone on Verizon's terms.

Not defending them. I don't agree with the practice. I think it is quickly become an ancient practice that more and more people will begin to take notice of and have issues with. It's an old mindset that is beginning to outgrow itself as they continue to abuse it. But it is what it is.

 

[13th angel]

I understand the difference, I was just using that to make the point..... yes, we agree to the terms but who really takes the time to read them? Not excusing it but its still valid....

Sent from my Liberated D2G

 

[armedmonkey]

There's nothing we can do about it. They hold all the cards. The phones are priced arbitrarily high (basically, by them, because they don't cost all that much to manufacture). They screw people into buying contracts because most people can't afford to pay $500-$700 for a phone. And all the phones you can get for <$200 are gonna be locked, stocked and ready to suck.

 

[Skull One]

I understand the difference, I was just using that to make the point..... yes, we agree to the terms but who really takes the time to read them? Not excusing it but its still valid....

Sent from my Liberated D2G

If you are dumb enough to legally sign a document you did not read, you deserve to be taken to the cleaner. Pure and simple.

Maybe one day the people that don't read will get a clue and then things CAN start changing for the better. But until then, the people that don't read and sign are the sheeple that helps the economy, strike that; big business, go round and round.

 

[Skull One]

There's nothing we can do about it. They hold all the cards. The phones are priced arbitrarily high (basically, by them, because they don't cost all that much to manufacture). They screw people into buying contracts because most people can't afford to pay $500-$700 for a phone. And all the phones you can get for <$200 are gonna be locked, stocked and ready to suck.

They are counting on that exact sheeple mentality. IF people quit buying the product, one of two things happen. The product is no longer offered or the product changes until it does start to sell.

The Android sheeple are worse than the Apple sheeple. They at least get a single platform, protected app market and consistent operating system to complain about.

This thread, all on its own, is justifying my move to iPhone.

 

[armedmonkey]

You've got me convinced. So, who's gonna front the $500 difference? I'll PM you my paypal account and you can subsidize my next phone instead of VZW .

Seriously, think about it... you can't have it both ways - cheap and free. Not to mention, if you buy a DX without a contract, it's still gonna come with bloat and a locked bootloader, so I don't see your point

 

[Skull One]

You've got me convinced. So, who's gonna front the $500 difference? I'll PM you my paypal account and you can subsidize my next phone instead of VZW .

Seriously, think about it... you can't have it both ways - cheap and free. Not to mention, if you buy a DX without a contract, it's still gonna come with bloat and a locked bootloader, so I don't see your point

You just provide beyond all shadow of a doubt you don't get it with that reply. I truly pity your ignorance.

I am to tired to try and explain such a simple concept of why the consumer has the power.

This will be my last post here.

 

[a44kaliburll]

You've got me convinced. So, who's gonna front the $500 difference? I'll PM you my paypal account and you can subsidize my next phone instead of VZW .

Seriously, think about it... you can't have it both ways - cheap and free. Not to mention, if you buy a DX without a contract, it's still gonna come with bloat and a locked bootloader, so I don't see your point

I read all of the posts...and I like the debate going on here...and the poster who said that you sign a contract, you agree to their terms. Not the other way around...I saw meat in that..I did agree with that..

Then you posted "even if you buy the DX unsubsidized its still locked...its still bogged down...That is very true too...

Man I like what I see in here...good arguments...

Subscribed!

 

[IceAngel8381]

Thats Android's big thing.......the open OS, or supposidly open OS. LOL

 

[armedmonkey]

You've got me convinced. So, who's gonna front the $500 difference? I'll PM you my paypal account and you can subsidize my next phone instead of VZW .

Seriously, think about it... you can't have it both ways - cheap and free. Not to mention, if you buy a DX without a contract, it's still gonna come with bloat and a locked bootloader, so I don't see your point

You just provide beyond all shadow of a doubt you don't get it with that reply. I truly pity your ignorance.

I am to tired to try and explain such a simple concept of why the consumer has the power.

This will be my last post here.

It sounds more like you've failed to make a point and are retreating to some other thread while saving some grace.

Your idealism borders on pedantic. Yes, if we stop buying everything and live off of what food and materials we produce ourselves then the nasty, evil corporations won't have us by the balls. Except for we need their stuff.

I can't afford to feed my idealism for $700 dollars. Most people can't. Phones break. You need a new phone, you will buy whatever is available. Am I wrong?

Gas prices are too high, so I'm not gonna buy gas. I'm going to bike 30 miles to and from work every day, right?

Before you criticize people for not seeing your point, please make sure you have actually MADE one.

 

[a44kaliburll]

You've got me convinced. So, who's gonna front the $500 difference? I'll PM you my paypal account and you can subsidize my next phone instead of VZW .

Seriously, think about it... you can't have it both ways - cheap and free. Not to mention, if you buy a DX without a contract, it's still gonna come with bloat and a locked bootloader, so I don't see your point

You just provide beyond all shadow of a doubt you don't get it with that reply. I truly pity your ignorance.

I am to tired to try and explain such a simple concept of why the consumer has the power.

This will be my last post here.

Noo! dont make this your last post..please?

this stuff is getting good..I agree with you that the consumer does have the power..but its like saying "we the people have the power" for our government.

I checked out this video "story of stuff" on youtube and watch the FEC vs The citizens united..I think...and it made me open my eyes.

Our government is driven by money..not the people anymore...yes we have the vote..but sometimes we dont really get to utilize that vote too well..

Verizon notices that we dont look at our contract..and yes we do deserve to be taken to the cleaners...I think that the vast majority of Verizon customers are uninformed joe public. Those people will willingly pay out of their hats for a phone and not look at their contracts.

I for one, think that if enough people banned together and made a statement..the the OP then we could eventually make a difference..big or small..and if its small..remind ourselves that it takes alot of small things to make a big difference.

We the customer do have the power...but when money is involved and the "cheaper is better" mindset is in plain view or even common practice...we the people/consumer will lose everytime.

 

[armedmonkey]

Verizon notices that we dont look at our contract..and yes we do deserve to be taken to the cleaners...I think that the vast majority of Verizon customers are uninformed joe public. Those people will willingly pay out of their hats for a phone and not look at their contracts.

OK. I read my contract. Now what? Every carrier has the same stuff in their contract. So, my choice is $200 or $700.

Let's all buy Ferraris. They are better cars than Ford and Honda. We should make a statement to Ford and Honda to make their cars better by not buying them anymore.

 

[Backnblack]

Thats Android's big thing.......the open OS, or supposidly open OS. LOL

It is open from the developer.....

 

[a44kaliburll]

You've got me convinced. So, who's gonna front the $500 difference? I'll PM you my paypal account and you can subsidize my next phone instead of VZW .

Seriously, think about it... you can't have it both ways - cheap and free. Not to mention, if you buy a DX without a contract, it's still gonna come with bloat and a locked bootloader, so I don't see your point

You just provide beyond all shadow of a doubt you don't get it with that reply. I truly pity your ignorance.

I am to tired to try and explain such a simple concept of why the consumer has the power.

This will be my last post here.

It sounds more like you've failed to make a point and are retreating to some other thread while saving some grace.

Your idealism borders on pedantic. Yes, if we stop buying everything and live off of what food and materials we produce ourselves then the nasty, evil corporations won't have us by the balls. Except for we need their stuff.

I can't afford to feed my idealism for $700 dollars. Most people can't. Phones break. You need a new phone, you will buy whatever is available. Am I wrong?

Gas prices are too high, so I'm not gonna buy gas. I'm going to bike 30 miles to and from work every day, right?

Before you criticize people for not seeing your point, please make sure you have actually MADE one.

point well made...

But if we did do those extremes (bike 30 miles to work) and a overwhelming majority made that sacrifice...then yeah I think things will change...but not like this...who wants to suffer? who wants to live without, especially when we've all lived a pretty padded life? who wants to actually work hard to get simple results?

No one, and until a HUGE majority decides that their dollar is worth more, we will be stuck with the corporations rule.
No one

 

[armedmonkey]

Thats Android's big thing.......the open OS, or supposidly open OS. LOL

It is open from the developer.....

IIRC all that Google's OHA (Open handset alliance) ever did was shake their finger and say "you guys shouldn't lock your stuff down, dudde"

a44kaliburll:
It's not about a decision. Assuming I was in good enough shape to do that, I still wouldn't be able to afford to. It would take too long and I've got too many other obligations. It's the same argument as the fact that most people can't AFFORD to spend $700 on a phone. Not that they choose not to.