To leave my iPhone 3GS

jntdroid

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Ok Darkseider, I know from other posts that you have historical reasons, as well, for hating Apple, but you're going a bit overboard now, in my humble opinion, in your generalizations. Google is no different than Apple. Their bottom line goal is to increase value for their shareholders. Why? B/c they are a for-profit corporation. Do they go about this differently? Yes. Is Google's way better than Apple's? I would argue no. People like Apple b/c Apple makes their life easier and they don't have to think about their Apple stuff for it to work - which is ok because they pump out phones and computers... some people actually have lives to focus on and don't want to worry about their stuff working. Are there lemmings? Yes. Are there Google/Android lemmings? You better believe it, and if you don't, you're fooling yourself. The only difference is, the Google/Android "lemmings" can tout themselves as simply "contrarians" that don't like some big evil corporation to "control how they use their phone", or whatever. I guarantee you if you move over to the ad side of Google, you'll find a LOT of people that hate how Google is running their business and likely put them in the same camp as Apple, or MS, or whomever. We, as Android/Gwhatever users, rarely see or experience that side. We only see all the free, open, "don't be evil" stuff that Google brings to the table.

The bottom line is user preference is the only thing that matters, and Apple and Google both have a lot of users that prefer one or the other for no other reason than that's what they like. If you actually think that morality or some philosophical reasons play a part in supporting a corporation, especially one that pumps out tech related products where the general public couldn't care less about how their product works, then I'm curious what other corporations you might support and their practices? I'm speaking for myself here as well. If we all stopped using products of companies whose practices we didn't like or didn't agree with (again, I'm talking about things like open-source or a closed garden - not sweat shops in China), we would have to stop using a lot more products than we realize.

And, DS, I didn't mean to sound like I singled you out - there are a lot of people that think that way and I simply think it's just as bad as the Apple fanboys. But to generalize Apple fans as nut sack cradling lemmings and to call Steve Jobs a prick (unless you know him personally?) is flat out frustrating to hear.
 

Darkseider

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Ok Darkseider, I know from other posts that you have historical reasons, as well, for hating Apple, but you're going a bit overboard now, in my humble opinion, in your generalizations. Google is no different than Apple. Their bottom line goal is to increase value for their shareholders. Why? B/c they are a for-profit corporation. Do they go about this differently? Yes. Is Google's way better than Apple's? I would argue no. People like Apple b/c Apple makes their life easier and they don't have to think about their Apple stuff for it to work - which is ok because they pump out phones and computers... some people actually have lives to focus on and don't want to worry about their stuff working. Are there lemmings? Yes. Are there Google/Android lemmings? You better believe it, and if you don't, you're fooling yourself. The only difference is, the Google/Android "lemmings" can tout themselves as simply "contrarians" that don't like some big evil corporation to "control how they use their phone", or whatever. I guarantee you if you move over to the ad side of Google, you'll find a LOT of people that hate how Google is running their business and likely put them in the same camp as Apple, or MS, or whomever. We, as Android/Gwhatever users, rarely see or experience that side. We only see all the free, open, "don't be evil" stuff that Google brings to the table.

The bottom line is user preference is the only thing that matters, and Apple and Google both have a lot of users that prefer one or the other for no other reason than that's what they like. If you actually think that morality or some philosophical reasons play a part in supporting a corporation, especially one that pumps out tech related products where the general public couldn't care less about how their product works, then I'm curious what other corporations you might support and their practices? I'm speaking for myself here as well. If we all stopped using products of companies whose practices we didn't like or didn't agree with (again, I'm talking about things like open-source or a closed garden - not sweat shops in China), we would have to stop using a lot more products than we realize.

And, DS, I didn't mean to sound like I singled you out - there are a lot of people that think that way and I simply think it's just as bad as the Apple fanboys. But to generalize Apple fans as nut sack cradling lemmings and to call Steve Jobs a prick (unless you know him personally?) is flat out frustrating to hear.

Well sorry I frustrate you but I am no more a Google fanboy than I am an Apple fanboy. Right now Google offers the best overall solution for a smartphone in its' OS, Android. The hardware running this OS is manufactured by multiple companies giving freedom and choice. Not only a choice of hardware and design but carrier as well. To generalized Apple fans as nut sack cradling lemmings, yeah I think I got that spot on, have you seen the Darwin award winners waiting in line for up to a WEEK early with multiple changes of clothing just in case they soil themselves!!? REALLY? As for Steve Jobs being a prick, although I don't know him personally, the few times I have met him he has been a flat out jack ass. On the flipside Steve Wozniak was cool as hell! So first impressions do count. Unfortunately for Steve Jobs his first impression sucked as have all the others that followed.
 

jntdroid

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Ok Darkseider, I know from other posts that you have historical reasons, as well, for hating Apple, but you're going a bit overboard now, in my humble opinion, in your generalizations. Google is no different than Apple. Their bottom line goal is to increase value for their shareholders. Why? B/c they are a for-profit corporation. Do they go about this differently? Yes. Is Google's way better than Apple's? I would argue no. People like Apple b/c Apple makes their life easier and they don't have to think about their Apple stuff for it to work - which is ok because they pump out phones and computers... some people actually have lives to focus on and don't want to worry about their stuff working. Are there lemmings? Yes. Are there Google/Android lemmings? You better believe it, and if you don't, you're fooling yourself. The only difference is, the Google/Android "lemmings" can tout themselves as simply "contrarians" that don't like some big evil corporation to "control how they use their phone", or whatever. I guarantee you if you move over to the ad side of Google, you'll find a LOT of people that hate how Google is running their business and likely put them in the same camp as Apple, or MS, or whomever. We, as Android/Gwhatever users, rarely see or experience that side. We only see all the free, open, "don't be evil" stuff that Google brings to the table.

The bottom line is user preference is the only thing that matters, and Apple and Google both have a lot of users that prefer one or the other for no other reason than that's what they like. If you actually think that morality or some philosophical reasons play a part in supporting a corporation, especially one that pumps out tech related products where the general public couldn't care less about how their product works, then I'm curious what other corporations you might support and their practices? I'm speaking for myself here as well. If we all stopped using products of companies whose practices we didn't like or didn't agree with (again, I'm talking about things like open-source or a closed garden - not sweat shops in China), we would have to stop using a lot more products than we realize.

And, DS, I didn't mean to sound like I singled you out - there are a lot of people that think that way and I simply think it's just as bad as the Apple fanboys. But to generalize Apple fans as nut sack cradling lemmings and to call Steve Jobs a prick (unless you know him personally?) is flat out frustrating to hear.

Well sorry I frustrate you but I am no more a Google fanboy than I am an Apple fanboy. Right now Google offers the best overall solution for a smartphone in its' OS, Android. The hardware running this OS is manufactured by multiple companies giving freedom and choice. Not only a choice of hardware and design but carrier as well. To generalized Apple fans as nut sack cradling lemmings, yeah I think I got that spot on, have you seen the Darwin award winners waiting in line for up to a WEEK early with multiple changes of clothing just in case they soil themselves!!? REALLY? As for Steve Jobs being a prick, although I don't know him personally, the few times I have met him he has been a flat out jack ass. On the flipside Steve Wozniak was cool as hell! So first impressions do count. Unfortunately for Steve Jobs his first impression sucked as have all the others that followed.

Well first of all, forgive me if I came across aggressively or just flat out rude. I typed that quickly and had just gotten off the phone with a client who was being completely irrational... and irrationality is one of my pet peeves (mirror planted in front of me).

"Right now Google offers the best overall solution for a smartphone in its' OS, Android. The hardware running this OS is manufactured by multiple companies giving freedom and choice. Not only a choice of hardware and design but carrier as well."

I still have to say that doesn't matter to 90% of the people out there so is somewhat of a moot point. To those in the know, such as yourself, that might be important, but most people couldn't care less.
 

Darkseider

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Ok Darkseider, I know from other posts that you have historical reasons, as well, for hating Apple, but you're going a bit overboard now, in my humble opinion, in your generalizations. Google is no different than Apple. Their bottom line goal is to increase value for their shareholders. Why? B/c they are a for-profit corporation. Do they go about this differently? Yes. Is Google's way better than Apple's? I would argue no. People like Apple b/c Apple makes their life easier and they don't have to think about their Apple stuff for it to work - which is ok because they pump out phones and computers... some people actually have lives to focus on and don't want to worry about their stuff working. Are there lemmings? Yes. Are there Google/Android lemmings? You better believe it, and if you don't, you're fooling yourself. The only difference is, the Google/Android "lemmings" can tout themselves as simply "contrarians" that don't like some big evil corporation to "control how they use their phone", or whatever. I guarantee you if you move over to the ad side of Google, you'll find a LOT of people that hate how Google is running their business and likely put them in the same camp as Apple, or MS, or whomever. We, as Android/Gwhatever users, rarely see or experience that side. We only see all the free, open, "don't be evil" stuff that Google brings to the table.

The bottom line is user preference is the only thing that matters, and Apple and Google both have a lot of users that prefer one or the other for no other reason than that's what they like. If you actually think that morality or some philosophical reasons play a part in supporting a corporation, especially one that pumps out tech related products where the general public couldn't care less about how their product works, then I'm curious what other corporations you might support and their practices? I'm speaking for myself here as well. If we all stopped using products of companies whose practices we didn't like or didn't agree with (again, I'm talking about things like open-source or a closed garden - not sweat shops in China), we would have to stop using a lot more products than we realize.

And, DS, I didn't mean to sound like I singled you out - there are a lot of people that think that way and I simply think it's just as bad as the Apple fanboys. But to generalize Apple fans as nut sack cradling lemmings and to call Steve Jobs a prick (unless you know him personally?) is flat out frustrating to hear.

Well sorry I frustrate you but I am no more a Google fanboy than I am an Apple fanboy. Right now Google offers the best overall solution for a smartphone in its' OS, Android. The hardware running this OS is manufactured by multiple companies giving freedom and choice. Not only a choice of hardware and design but carrier as well. To generalized Apple fans as nut sack cradling lemmings, yeah I think I got that spot on, have you seen the Darwin award winners waiting in line for up to a WEEK early with multiple changes of clothing just in case they soil themselves!!? REALLY? As for Steve Jobs being a prick, although I don't know him personally, the few times I have met him he has been a flat out jack ass. On the flipside Steve Wozniak was cool as hell! So first impressions do count. Unfortunately for Steve Jobs his first impression sucked as have all the others that followed.

Well first of all, forgive me if I came across aggressively or just flat out rude. I typed that quickly and had just gotten off the phone with a client who was being completely irrational... and irrationality is one of my pet peeves (mirror planted in front of me).

"Right now Google offers the best overall solution for a smartphone in its' OS, Android. The hardware running this OS is manufactured by multiple companies giving freedom and choice. Not only a choice of hardware and design but carrier as well."

I still have to say that doesn't matter to 90% of the people out there so is somewhat of a moot point. To those in the know, such as yourself, that might be important, but most people couldn't care less.

Understood, no offense taken. So assuming that to 90% of the people choice and freedom doesn't matter and irrationality being one of your pet peeves, what percentage of that 90% would classify as being irrational for not weighing their purchasing options or for that matter waiting in line, skipping work or even soiling themselves to get an iPhone 4? All on the word of the Steve Jobs saying it is the greatest thing since the first coming of Christ?
 

jntdroid

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Understood, no offense taken. So assuming that to 90% of the people choice and freedom doesn't matter and irrationality being one of your pet peeves, what percentage of that 90% would classify as being irrational for not weighing their purchasing options or for that matter waiting in line, skipping work or even soiling themselves to get an iPhone 4? All on the word of the Steve Jobs saying it is the greatest thing since the first coming of Christ?

Well, the 90% number I obviously pulled out of my rear, so to be more accurate (or rather less accurate, but more rational :)), I would replace 90% with "large majority".

I'm saying that a "large majority" don't care about freedom and choice when it comes to things like smartphones and computers. They want what works and what's easiest for them to use. I do believe that this is changing, especially as kids are growing up so tech "savvy" now.

There are so many subjective things to weigh in this situation... simplicity of use, familiarity, cost, carriers (yes some people actually have good service with AT&T), upgrade/switching cost, functionality, etc... that I don't think rationality necessarily plays a huge part. For example, if AT&T's service was as bad as some people make it out to be, the iPhone would be rendered useless. But obviously AT&T's service has been good enough for most of their customers (their retention rate remains strong).

The people that will soil themselves waiting in line? Yes, that's completely irrational and more sad than anything else. I get, if you're an Apple fan, wanting to do it for the "experience" :)confused:) or whatever, that's their prerogative. But to go to those extremes when 2 weeks later you can likely walk in and get one... silly imho.

So I guess you've called me out on something... irrationality is a pet peeve of mine, but it seems only when it's combined with dogmatism... and smartphones and software/hardware philosophies or practices are not something that, I think, require any sort of dogmatism at this point. It's not like open-source is more ethical or moral than the alternative. It's not like having freedom and choice of hardware is more moral or ethical than a company controlling/manufacturing every aspect of their build. One could make a good argument for both sides. (though I might contradict myself with my note to the OP at the end of this novel... :))

As for Steve Jobs, yeah he blows some smoke (what marketer doesn't?), and he may or may not be a jerk, but you gotta credit him for being passionate about his products, likely to a fault at times.


On a "side" note ;), to help the OP out a little, this is extremely interesting... doesn't seem widespread, but if there are even 10% that are doing this, I would consider it a huge problem:

[video=youtube;03PQyWp0mWE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03PQyWp0mWE"]YouTube - iPhone 4 Drops Calls when Left Corner is Touched[/video]
 

cpjr

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Yup, and no matter how bad you may dislike Apple....the fact that they still hold the #1 spot for smartphones with only ONE device is pretty impressive, no matter how you look at it. I know Android is closing in....but Apple has accomplished alot, especially considering they have only been in the smartphone market for 3 years.
 

jroc

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Yup, and no matter how bad you may dislike Apple....the fact that they still hold the #1 spot for smartphones with only ONE device is pretty impressive, no matter how you look at it. I know Android is closing in....but Apple has accomplished alot, especially considering they have only been in the smartphone market for 3 years.

Do u mean #1 spot as far as sales or popularity? Cuz the last time I checked RIM/Blackberry had the #1 spot.

I give Apple credit for advancing the smartphone market to where it is now. No one is trying to compete with RIM, they trying to compete with Apple. Thats amazing. Making capacitive screens popular, thank u Apple for that one. But Apple is also looking at someone's back too.

Apple does such a good job of hyping and advertising that most ppl dont really know who is number 1. U right: whatever spot they're in, for them to be there using only one device is amazing.
 

brianr0131

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or check out the iPhone 4... it's pretty awesome too (just not AS awesome)

I don't know about the awesomeness of the iPhone 4...

Some iPhone 4 models dropping calls when held left-handed, including ours (video) -- Engadget

That looks more like fail than awesome.

Meh...I saw Josh from Engadget on Jimmy Fallon swinging from the i phones proverbial nuts. He was talking about driving through tunnels and here and there without dropping a call.

I doubt the reception issue is as big as people (engadget included) are making it. Holding the phone in that area probably lowers the signal strength but I doubt it immediately drops your calls. The phone will be a huge success. Bet on it.

With that said....OP.....drop the Iphone and go Android.
 
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U

UnKnownviper113

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I went today to look at the evo had it for 21 min and took it back. It could not get 3G or send text looks like I will get the x
 
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