Apple is falling

Discussion in 'Android News' started by pc747, Sep 11, 2013.

  1. Gremlin

    Gremlin Active Member

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    Here is my take on yesterday's presentation.. innovative regarding the fingerprint scanner on the iphone 5s.. Hmm anyone remember the HP Ipaq series???
     
  2. dezymond

    dezymond Tech Support Mod Staff Member Premium Member

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    I think the upgrades to the 5s are more significant than any of the other S in the past. I was expecting the hardware upgrades to the CPU, camera, or whatever else have you. The fingerprint scanner was the curveball. Everywhere I read about the phone had that being as a notification light, but it far surpassed that rumor.

    edit: And for someone who finds the extra security measures for a lock screen to be a pain, this idea appeals to me and I am jealous of it. However, I want to see this feature in action and see if it's one of those cases if it's too good to be true. Also if any flaws will be discovered with it.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2013
  3. jntdroid

    jntdroid DF Super Moderator Premium Member

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    Gotcha - I guess I'm coming at this under the assumption that the iPhone 5 would've been dropped to $100 just like the 5C is.
     
  4. pc747

    pc747 DF Administrator Staff Member Rescue Squad

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    is the fingerprint scanner innovative, no but like dezy pointed out it is a nice idea especially putting it on the home button. Dezy good point because I overlooked that and have to give apple kudos for that idea.

    Ck to your last post, exactly. I wasnt down playing the plastic because you right to have a cheaper iphone in different colors would be marketable because of the teenage population. But dezy put it perfect in that you have the s for high range, have the 5 for mid range, and have the 5c for low range. Now I have to admit that my 199 price point was low for even the iphone 5c being the 5s is going to sell for 699 (16 gb model), the 5 would drop about 100 bucks to about 599, so I am thinking 399 would be about what I would have expected the iphone 5c to be off contract.
     
  5. pc747

    pc747 DF Administrator Staff Member Rescue Squad

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    I don't know the iphone 5 built wise did a great job on drop tests. But I am interested in seeing how the polycarbonate handles drop tests and real world wear and tear.
     
  6. cereal killer

    cereal killer DF Administrator Staff Member

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    Maybe they are not that interested in emerging markets, I dunno. It's obvious they aren't looking to penetrate emerging markets, but "why?" is my biggest question. Maybe they know they can't compete with Windows Phone and Android in these markets so why bother. I don't know.

    They will see increased margins when selling the 5C so maybe that's their bottom line. It's a mystery.....to me at least :)
     
  7. pc747

    pc747 DF Administrator Staff Member Rescue Squad

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    But the purpose of the 5c, at least from what I gather, was to penetrate into emerging markets which is where samsung and htc is doing well. I think they didnt do enough home work in those markets.
     
  8. combatmedic870

    combatmedic870 Senior Member

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    Is not the same phone as the 5. it loses the metal build and sapphire glass lens.
    Those I'm sure are two decent cost savers. Don't agree with this.
    I have an I phone 5 the build will quality is very very good. Hope this raises the value of it!
    Getting a note 3 next I think.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2013
  9. CBMGGM

    CBMGGM Member

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    I tend to agree as well. They have nothing new to offer other than an ungraded CPU in the 5S and a more polished OS. Most of my co-workers that currently own the fruity phone are dumping them quickly. Not one showed the least bit of interest in yesterday's launch. Times have changed since 2007; that's one of Apple's faults. They still think it's '07. I had a bet with a friend of mine. By the end of 2013 Apple's stocks would drop below $500.00 It's only September and they are almost there. Just think in mid 2012 they were close to $1K a share. Apple meet Blackberry..... Time to wake up Mr. Cook
     
  10. Hugh Jass

    Hugh Jass Senior Member

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    I think all of you are wrong. Apple is doing what Apple has always done, and this is no different really. You can say investors sense weakness, Apple lost Jobs and thus it's direction, so on and so forth...but not me. What I see is the most competitive market the smartphone has seen yet. We have GS4, LGG2, HTC-One, Huawei, Sony Xperia, Nokia Lumia, Galaxy Note, and I hate to list it but all the Motorola's too... and all the differentiation's and mini's in-between. All of these devices are great.

    This is the first time the market isn't just flooded with Android, it's flooded with fantastic android. Fragmentation is down. Rooting is a luxury instead of a necessity. Options galore.

    Apple hasn't lost their touch, they're business model simply isn't designed to compete with this. They release X number of devices at X time of the year and upgrade X time of the year, and that is set in stone because that's how they operate...predictably. They aren't going to pump out 2 upgrades back to back with crazy new designs that creates holes in their software from device to device. They're precise, conservative, and conscientious to their image and believe that predictability is key to reliability and consumer trust. The rest of the market is aggressive, tactical, and frankly overwhelming, relying on the numbers to gain market-share. To change what has been set in stone for years will eliminate the fanboyism that floats the company today, to be like the rest is to concede they're place in the market and will guarantee their failure over time. Apple is in quicksand, and to struggle is futile and only hastens their suffocation. They don't need change, they need more of the same.
     
  11. CBMGGM

    CBMGGM Member

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    I thought there was a fan boy somewhere in this thread. I completely disagree with most of your reasoning. The Mobile Market is changing so rapidly with explosive growth; faster turnaround of product is essential to a company's lifespan. I hate to say this but we are watching the slow death of Apple. Huge things are happening in 2014 with Google. The 800 pound gorilla will double in size very soon.
     
  12. pc747

    pc747 DF Administrator Staff Member Rescue Squad

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    Fanboys...no think a lot of that has died down...tech fans yes. I really do not think apple is dying. I believe right now they are in a slump and that was why i asked who would benefit most from the slump. But apple has a lot of good engineers and talented people working for them. Inspiration can comes from desperation. The Galaxy S when it first came out grabbed attentions but with slow updates and different models for different carriers Samsung was looking up at HTC, Motorola, and Apple. It wasnt until the galaxy s2 and Galaxy note that people started to turn heads. I expect apple to come back strong which will be good for the market. A strong apple elevates the competition keeping android oems from getting lazy. That is my concern about Samsung now that we can argue that they are top dog right now. Will they slip up or will another android oem be able to come up with the next "it factor" that will turn eyes toward them?
    Personally I am hoping motorola can step up and bring to the market that device that truly turn heads.
     
  13. Hugh Jass

    Hugh Jass Senior Member

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    If you assume I'm an Apple fan, you're wrong in every way. Last Apple thing I owned was the original iPod that I found on a bench at school that no one claimed in the lost and found.

    But I do think they hold fantastic market-share for a reason, and obviously a really good one since if any other brand tried their tactics they wouldn't last 12 months. They don't have to reinvent wheels to keep a car moving like everyone else, they just change the tires once in a while. Sure this gets old over time, and as every thing what goes up must come down. Google can not last forever. Walmart can not last forever. Nothing can...but suggesting that they should reverse everything that makes them what they are is genuinely corporate suicide for Apple.

    Just because they fold a hand doesn't mean they don't hold pocket Aces, you can't underestimate the potential and capital that they've developed. They might not innovate fast enough for the world around them, but I doubt anyone but Google could go all in like they can if they have to.
     
  14. dgstorm

    dgstorm Editor in Chief Staff Member Premium Member

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    I'd like to add that I was fairly impressed with the iPhone 5S announcement yesterday, and I have never been impressed with an iPhone. (I primarily liked the 64-bit CPU tech because I didn't expect this to come so soon).

    However, I would also like to point out that the Touch ID fingerprint scanner has actually been done before. The Motorola Atrix (an Android phone) had a fingerprint scanner that allowed you to unlock the phone. It never caught on as more than a gimmick. Of course, Apple are the grand masters of marketing so they perhaps will be able to make the fingerprint scanner much more usable and appealing to the masses.

    Ultimately, Apple is in a tough spot when it comes to investors. On the one hand, if they had brought out a truly mass market affordable price on the iPhone 5C like investors were clamoring for, then the stock price probably would have jumped. However, if they had, then 6 months to a year down the road, these same investors would be selling off Apple stock. This would be due to Apple's famously high profit margins eroding because they are selling a device at a much cheaper price point than in the past. Either they appeal to the investors now, or they stick to the game plan that has always worked for them, and that is making a product with a premium reputation and a premium price tag.

    In the long run, Apple's deals with China and Japan will bring a huge influx of cash from selling the iPhone 4S at the low end, the iPhone 5C at the mid-range, and the iPhone 5S in the high-end. Those same investors who sold off Apple stock now will probably be buying at that time.

    As far as Apple falling since Steve Jobs' death, that is actually a different subject really. I will say this, the company doesn't seem to be as innovative or edgy as it was before, and may have lost some of its "mystique." Perhaps it's missing a bit of its creative fire. This will definitely have an impact at some point, but it will probably be a slow effect over a long period of time.

    Just my analysis... :)
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2013
  15. dezymond

    dezymond Tech Support Mod Staff Member Premium Member

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    I like to think Apple as the brick oven of the competition. They may not provide the latest technology and they don't cook up a new idea as quick as they used to, but whatever the end product is it's pretty dang good, like a brick oven pizza:p

    I agree mostly with Hugh because Android does move at a rate that not many other companies can keep up at, especially since Android appeals to almost every market from low to high end. Apple has and always will be high end, that was their target audience since the company's birth and it will be til if/when they fade away. They're more about refining than innovating nowadays, but they certainly don't need to change things up. In fact, Samsung took a page out of Apple's blueprint with the s4/N3 and that seems to be working out quite well for them as well.

    They may not change at the rapid rate Android does, but there are millions of people who like to stick with what they know. Apple provides that stability and reliability for that audience. Call them sheep or what have you, but they're the ones keeping Apple alive and helping Android innovate as they are. If Apple is slowly dying like I think they are for the past couple years, then it's going to be a slow slow one that won't really be felt for many more years to come I think.
     
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